Side Project Podcast 8: Fashion with Janel Dyan

Leyla Seka (00:01.017)

Hello everyone and welcome to Side Project, our little foray through the quagmire that is middle age. And so today I’m here with my good friend Ruthie. Ruthie, what are we gonna talk about today?

 

Ruthie Miller (00:14.944)

I’m super excited to be here because we’re talking about something today that is sort of a little bit of an outlier in a lot of the things that we’ve been talking about. And that is fashion, and specifically is middle age where fashion goes to die? Because that was a question we kind of raised before we started doing these things. And you know, the obvious answer is no, but at times I kind of feel like maybe I am proof that it is where fashion goes to die, honestly. Leyla, what’s your take on this?

 

Leyla Seka (00:47.449)

Well, I only wear black, right? So I figured out a long time ago how to skirt this conversation. But I think about it a lot. And I do like, I walk into anthropology, I’m like, yeah, I’ve aged out of this place like 150 years ago. And then I walk into Ann Taylor and I’m like, I’m not this old. So I’m somewhere in the nether zone. I don’t really know. There’s a lot of black in my closet as we were just talking about.

 

Ruthie Miller (01:08.384)

Ha

 

Leyla Seka (01:17.295)

But I’m excited because our guest today knows a lot about fashion and she’s helped me and a lot of people with this. So I’m excited to chat with her and get her take.

 

Ruthie Miller (01:25.344)

Absolutely. We are sitting here today with Janel Dyan. Janel is a brand advisor, stylist and speaker, and she’s also the bestselling author of Story Style Brand: Why Corporate Results Are a Matter of Personal Style. And I love this part. Janelle actually developed her own methodology to serve as a blueprint for women like us to create their own personal brand. And what she does, and this is what I need, is she tries to help people ask not what should I wear today, but more of what story do I want to tell? I’m interested in learning more about that. So welcome, Janel! Thank you so much for joining us.

 

Janel Dyan (02:04.706)

Thank you. I’m so excited to be here. I’ve been looking forward to this.

 

Leyla Seka (02:09.663)

So, I mean, there’s lots of ways we can think about this, but let’s start for a minute on your philosophy, because I think that’s sort of an important thing. And that is like, how do I tell a story and what do the clothes in my closet portray? Like, what are they saying when I walk in a room or all that? How does one break that concept down and really think about it as, because what you wear is very personal, right? I mean, it’s very much like I wear black because it’s neutral and very few people judge me in this, right? At least not in San Francisco. How do you think through that?

 

Janel Dyan (02:44.662)

Yeah, so fashion is its own language, right? And so I like to always think of what is the conversation that I wanna have when I walk into a room or what is the conversation that I wanna have to myself before I leave my house so that when I step out of the door, I’m confident and I’m gonna be my best self, right? So I see kind of in three parts and that’s the method that you kind of reference, which is start with your story, right? Who am I? Where am I going in my life? Like right now I’m a mom of a toddler that drools everywhere and what’s my story? Who am I? And then from there it’s then what do I wanna wear and why do I wanna wear this piece or why do I wanna wear this look? And that then starts that conversation you’re gonna have. 

 

That’s the whole concept of what I see as fashion, as language, as a way to tell your story, as a way to connect with other people. And so that’s kind of the crux of it. So let’s say now, you know, with some of my clients, it’s the middle age and we’re like, look, we’ve got it. I don’t know if I can swear, but we’ve got a shit ton of clothes in our closet. We’ve got a ton of stories that those clothes are going to tell.

 

We’ve got our favorite college sweater that’s, you know, probably stolen from your ex-boyfriend that you never returned because he broke your heart. Right? You’ve got your first J.Crew professional collared shirt that kind of fits, but for some reason it makes you feel good when you need to put it back on. Or you’ve got those red bottom heels from your board days or whatever it is. We’ve got a ton of stories in our closet and it, and like you said, fashion goes to die. Fashion doesn’t die in our closet. It just needs to be revisited and go back in there and say, okay, what are all these stories that are happening? And I’m gonna take them out and I’m gonna say, now here I am, and I’m gonna try them back on and say, what works for me, what doesn’t work? But again, our closet is a gold mine for so many reasons, for so many ways and reasons, because we can go back in there and find out, revisit different stories, say that story still lives with me, that’s still the same story I wanna tell, that’s still the same communication I wanna have or conversation I wanna have. And so it starts within your closet.

 

Leyla Seka (05:04.389)

Right, so the jeans that are too small for me in my closet are the story I want to tell in the future when they fit me?

 

Janel Dyan (05:09.9)

Well, that’s a great point, right? So then what do we do with the jeans that don’t fit, but we somehow don’t get rid of them. And so what I say is take a Saturday, start early when you know, you feel your thinnest, go put those jeans back on say, Nope, not working. Cause my hormones are changing. My midsection is thicker, but I’m to put them on one more time. I’m going to relive that little thing, whatever that might be. The first concert you go to or whatever it is, and then put them in a pile and pass them on. Because as we go through those pieces and say, not now, you know, it was then, but not now, we get rid of it, we feel lighter. And when we feel lighter, we kind of feel happier. And we haven’t even lost a pound on the scale, right? Cause who likes to weigh themselves, but you’re starting to get rid of these stories that no longer identify with you. And you start to pare down into pieces that really do work for you.

 

Ruthie Miller (06:03.776)

So how do you go about creating your own brand through your style choices? And how does our brand evolve, actually? I feel like maybe I had one brand when I was in my 20s, and then I had a different brand when I was in my 30s, and now I’m in my late 40s, and I’m a totally different person. How do I kind of revisit that brand now that I’m a little bit older?

 

Janel Dyan (06:29.806)

So when you’re asking brand, you asking like a Prada versus a Gucci? 

 

Ruthie Miller (06:34.462)

No, no, like personal brand.

 

Janel Dyan (06:29.806)

So I think, I think right now taking away the fashion piece of it, think middle age right now for women, there’s three key factors that are happening for us. We’ve got three changes. We’ve got our physical change, right? With our menopause and perimenopause. We have our mental health and emotional change that’s happening. And then we also have our change of lifestyle, right? Our change of priorities that are happening. So if I can, I’d like to address that first before we then go into what brand we are. So if we can understand this, then we can understand what cuts we wear. We can understand what colors we choose, right? So we are physically changing. We know that I could go on. What is it? 50 different things that happened during perimenopause, right? But let’s take a few.

 

We’ve got hormonal changes and our body shapes are changing. Our estrogen is dropping. And so we’re getting thicker in the middle, like I said earlier. And so how does that change what we wear? It changes the fabrics we pick, right? It changes the high-waisted skirts or high-waisted jeans. They don’t feel right anymore. They’re not just, they’re not closing in. Or when you sit down, you’ve got some extra muffin top that’s coming over it. And you’re like, eh, I don’t like this.

 

This used to be my thing, right? So we need to shift and say, okay, I’m going to accept this body I have. I’m going to love it. First of all, I may be grateful that I’m still here and healthy and I’m going to wear it differently. I’m going to get flexible waistbands, right? I mean, the jeans these days, brilliant. They’re no longer Levi tight, right? So let’s, let’s love those, right? We also have skin changes. So our collagen is decreasing. And so we are a little looser in the arms, you know, my neck has a little bit more skin that’s happening. Right? We’ve got, we’ve got, you know, saggier in other areas. Let’s just be honest, right? And so what does that mean? Well, we’re going to shift to the fabrics we wear. And so we have silks or cottons or linens that will smooth out those areas. Cuts where, you know, you’re going to be doing three quarters, maybe, maybe not the tank tops, if that makes you feel more confident, not comfortable, but confident.

 

Ruthie Miller (08:34.329)

Yes!

 

Janel Dyan (08:56.268)

We have hot flashes, hot flashes, hot flashes. How does that change what we wear? We can’t wear wool as much anymore, right? We, you know, our skin texture is also drier and so you feel scratchier, itchier, things don’t feel right. We have boob sweat. Gotta think about moisture wicking athleisure wear. If you can do a Lulu tank top underneath a great killer blazer, do it because you’re soaking it all up, then you’re not worried about it. Right? I mean, you’ve got like new deodorants that are even happening for us. You also have changes in hair texture, which is gonna affect what, you know, your fashion and your style. My hair is thinning again. I used to be short. I might go shorter again. If I go short, my neck is now more noticeable, right? That’s gonna change the cuts that I wear. Lower necks might look better on me. 

 

Ruthie Miller (09:27.368)

You’re speaking my language.

 

Janel Dyan (09:55.022)

But those things shift. We also are growing gray and more and more women are embracing the color as we change. So grays and those hues go differently with different colors that you put on your body. And so those will be changing. Two other ones that I love, shoes. My heels don’t work the same. Our bone density is changing, right? So what do we do with that? I’m in loving all these different fun brands of Rothy’s are coming back. Clerics is a great mule that you can wear. On Running shoes are so cool, but not boxy, because, you know, your feet still kind of hurt. And so embracing that, I’m not saying goodbye to the heels, but just saying not now. Right now I’m going to just feel confident first and kind of get my groove back. 

 

Ruthie Miller (10:46.216)

I love that sneakers are in fashion now. That is something that I have absolutely embraced.

 

Janel Dyan (10:49.55)

Yeah, absolutely. We want to be comfortable because then we’re confident, right? And then the other one is our breasts are changing our sizes. And so what used to be a V-neck that would hit, you know, kind of the middle collarbone is now kind of getting, you know, kind of getting, not a V-neck. It’s going into a U-ish kind of, right? Or, you know, for some women, breasts that are growing is a welcomed thing.

 

Leyla Seka (10:55.588)

Right.

 

Janel Dyan (11:21.302)

And so the V-necks are now suddenly fun for them, right? And so just understanding all those things does play a part in how we’re dressing and what we’re wearing. And then the other part is our mental and emotional changes, right? So we’ve got mood swings, we’ve got anxieties, we’ve got depression that can happen. We’re having somewhat of an identity crisis going on, like who we are. so acknowledging that, giving us self-grace, embracing that, saying, All right, if I’m anxious, what do I put on that gives me more confidence? For me, it’s the collared shirt. Even today, I was anxious for this. I’m always anxious. And so I’m gonna embrace it and say, all right, I really want to wear a white t-shirt because that’s my comfort. But I know that if I put on a collared top, I’m gonna feel more confident and I’m gonna be my best self and be authentic. And then you also got changes of life. So we’ve got the empty nest syndrome, right?

 

Or I say the bird launchers that we’re doing. And right, we’re launching birds. 

 

Ruthie Miller (12:23.582)

Ha, I love that. I haven’t heard that before. I think that’s really cute.

 

Leyla Seka (12:28.335)

Yeah.

 

Janel Dyan (12:33.696)

Yeah, my mom was really sweet. I’m crying, my sons went to college, and she’s like, you’re launching birds. And so that’s a big identity crisis, right? We’re no longer going to be dressing for the soccer field. We’re no longer going to be dressing for school events, right? Some of us are saying, well, what are we gonna dress for? What do we do? And then you have women that are jumping out of their careers, right? Saying, I’m not gonna go nine to five. I’m not gonna be doing boards or whatever, and I’m gonna transition and now what? And so that changes also kind of who am I, right? Going back to your closet, who am I? What do I wear and what’s my conversation? So those are a lot of things that are happening for us.

 

Leyla Seka (13:11.0)

Right. I mean, that’s so like practically, cause I think all of that’s a hundred percent true, right? I mean, I’m, my kid’s about to go to college. You know, the school events are going down. I don’t have a full-time job right now. I mean, you’re hard pressed to get me out of sweatpants, right? And since no one can see what I’m wearing, thanks to platforms like this, you know, I’m definitely living there. But when I do get dressed, I feel them. 

 

Ruthie Miller (13:34.078)

Are you even wearing pants right now? 

 

Leyla Seka (13:39.429)

Of course I’m wearing pants, I’m wearing spritz pants.

 

Ruthie Miller (13:40.704)

Who knows? Maybe I’m not. I don’t know.

 

Janel Dyan (13:39.598)

And now there are jean sweat pants

 

Leyla Seka (13:49.701)

Oooh, that’s exciting. I’m adding that to my list.

 

Ruthie Miller (13:50.176)

Checking it out.

 

Janel Dyan (13:52.537)

And my niece came to me and said, Janel, you have to get some. I was like, okay. And they button like jeans. I mean, no joke. No joke. Like it’s not jeggings or whatever. It’s pretty sweet. Yeah, yeah, Rag & Bone.

 

Leyla Seka (14:06.021)

I’m adding that to my list. But like, okay, so you have a keen fashion style. You’ve like evolved this, but like for the average person that, I mean, walks into their closet and is like, I hate it all. Or like, I like one, two things, how does one kind of think about, especially in midlife, when to your point, so much is changing, right? Like your body’s changing, your emotional state’s changing, your circumstances are often changing, kids leaving, parents passing, lot of people getting divorced. I mean, lots of crazy things are happening all the time at this state in life. How does one really think about the styles and like the things that look or will feel best on them and then propagate that in their closet? So, I mean, sometimes I’ll find a shirt I like and I’ll just buy it in like every color or I’ll buy like three of the black one just so can wear it over and over again and have different ones. Is that crazy? Is that a good thing to do? Like, how do we think about that?

 

Janel Dyan (15:05.014)

If you’re doing it with purpose and knowing why you’re doing it, I think that’s important. I mean, if you, in an ideal world, I would love it if someone would, a woman goes back into her closet, literally, and just puts everything back on. And just experience that on, right? And then get rid of those pieces because then once you, it’s kind of like a couch, right? You’ve got all these pillows and all these colors and all these seasons and all these throw blankets and you don’t know what to do with them. So go back and kind of pick them back out, pull them back out, and you’re gonna see that you actually have a trend. You actually do have cuts that you’ve always been, that you’ve always liked, right? You’ve always had colors that you’ve always liked. And the ones that you, when you look at your closet, you’re always picking probably the same 15 pieces that you’ve always had. But then you’ve got that red one just in case, you’ve got that yellow one because that so-and-so said it looked great on your skin tone and you hated it, but you did it anyway, because you think your closet should look better.

 

Go back and do that first, I would say. And while you’re doing that, putting it on, put things to the side that you like, keep things that you really like, but you’re not quite sure how to incorporate accessories too. Like bring out the accessories, put them on, try them on, do, and then kind of clear that, okay? Now you’ve got this new set of a couch or of your wardrobe. You’re gonna start to see, okay, there’s the same storyline happening here, right? I tend to like this, cut this texture, this color, this coziness, whatever it is. And I’m confident in that, right? I tend to like caftans, right? And then at the same time, and you, you know, a lot of us have talked about this before, social media is a brilliant place to go as well. So, and looking on social media and Instagram and stuff, and you’ll start to see what are you attracted to? Like Frank & Eileen is a brand that I love, right? I love to travel in it. I just love the way their lifestyle looks on. I want that feel and look. I will say I love their, their travel sets, right? I love their pants. And so again, I’m, I know that Frank & Eileen is something I like because I’ve always been someone with a high neckline. I learned that in my closet and I now see that on Instagram. So starting to just really get some data points for yourself.

 

Ruthie Miller (17:06.9)

Same, 100%.

 

Leyla Seka (17:07.801)

Me too.

 

Janel Dyan (17:28.4)

Another brilliant one is when you see another middle-aged woman and you think she’s stunning and she’s crushing it in the parking lot in the grocery store, there’s no harm. All women love to share it. I love your sweater. Where’d you get that? Dude, those pants are awesome, right? My girlfriend is wearing Nili Lotan khakis. I love them. So I ask her, can I see your waistband? And I’m like, know, ask around and you’ll start to get a feel for your style, your look, your cuts, your fabrics.

 

Ruthie Miller (18:02.302)

Now earlier you were talking about colors, and I have to say I’m like I’m a solid blue girl. I’m pretty much never not wearing navy. What? How do I break out of that and how do I try new things? And this is sort of dovetailing with a trend that I’ve seen on social media and also here where I live in Houston. A lot of my friends are having their colors done where they go to a person.

 

Janel Dyan (18:26.742)

Yeah, it’s a resurgence.

 

Ruthie Miller (18:28.69)

And they have their colors done and they suggest colors for their clothes and also for their makeup and things like that. What do you think about that? And is that a good way to add different colors other than navy to my wardrobe? Or are there other things I should be doing?

 

Janel Dyan (18:47.63)

Well, I feel that that goes into a rule, right? Which I hate rules. So I think, you know, I remember we had our colors done when I was like five, I remember watching my mom with those like swaths, right? And then you have your book that you travel with. So my question to you is why Navy? For you.

 

Ruthie Miller (19:07.512)

I think it looks better. I have very fair skin and so black next to my skin is very jarring and I feel like navy is a little bit softer. It hides many sins much like black, but it just is less jarring with my fair skin. Plus blue is my favorite color. So, and there’s so many different shades of blue. Navy is the one I like the most, but really all blues.

 

Janel Dyan (19:24.918)

Okay. And when you go into your closet, what are the colors that I would see?

 

Ruthie Miller (19:36.8)

Navy and white, and I come home and my husband is like, really? Did you need to buy another Navy and white striped shirt? I’m like, but it’s different. It’s a different Navy and white striped shirt. But I’ve been trying. I try some pinks and some greens. I like the cool colors.

 

Janel Dyan (19:46.246)

Okay, and so when you’re reading and learning of all of your friends and women that are now getting their colors done, does it feel like something you want to explore? Does it feel like something that you should or you’re missing out on or is that the right thing to do?

 

Ruthie Miller (20:12.458)

I’m a little nervous that I’m gonna go and she’s gonna tell me never wear blue.

 

Janel Dyan (20:16.984)

Well, who cares? That’s just perfect. Right? I mean, honestly, think if blue is what you love and all forms of blue is what you love, go for it. I think for me, I struggle with being told that these are the colors I should wear because they’ll sit in my closet, but they don’t bring me joy. I don’t feel authentic, right? I mean, I can wear the yellow dress. I can wear the, you know, purple or whatever, but I just don’t feel me. So for me, I’d say, you know yourself.

 

Ruthie Miller (20:33.79)

Yeah, okay.

 

Janel Dyan (20:47.158)

You’re crushing it. Have fun with maybe accessories. Have fun with all blue with a pop of pink. Do shoes, right? If you want to play the game for this fall or play the game for, you know, an event or everyone’s saying this is the new hue, like that’s what I do. Like I got the red Rothy’s, right? Because I wanted to wear red. I don’t like wearing red on my body.

 

Leyla Seka (21:07.684)

Yeah.

 

Janel Dyan (21:13.12)

It feels way too bright and bold. And for me like, God, that’s not me, right? But I want to play the game. I want to have some fun. I want to live, you know, try and experiment. Cause we should not stop experimenting. We should never stop experimenting.

 

Ruthie Miller (21:26.336)

And that is a good point. Last fall I was doing a lot of navy blue with burgundy because burgundy seemed to be a fun color at the time. So I would have a burgundy bag and a burgundy belt and my burgundy loafers that I wear most days.

 

Janel Dyan (21:38.638)

And that’s telling a story right there, which is I’m solid in who I am. I’m unwavering. am exactly the same. I am confident. I am put together. I feel good about myself. And now I’m going to have a little bit of fun. I’m going to do my burgundy. I’m going to do this or do that. yeah, think, again, it goes back to why. Why are you getting your colors done? Why are you choosing yellow? Does it bring you joy? Does it make you happy?

 

Do you feel confident in it? And is it the right cut and style for what you want for that day? I mean, some people just do it with their nails, right? That’s their color. A pop of color is a conversation starter. A handbag is a conversation starter. There’s different ways to use fashion as language.

 

Leyla Seka (22:28.229)

So you’re not so stuck on rules, Janelle. You’re not like, you know, no white after the Labor Day, whatever. I mean, that one, maybe you are, but I don’t know. I never listened to any of those rules. Obviously I wear black every day, all day. But when we hear people like, middle-aged women shouldn’t have long hair, right? I’ve heard that one my whole life. And I’m like, I don’t look good with short hair. Like my face looks like, you know, Pac-Man. I don’t like it. But you know, like they’re all these sort of rules we’ve heard growing up and like things we should do. So it’s not that maybe we shouldn’t let, know, middle age isn’t really about like following rules or basically you do what makes you, brings you joy, makes you confident.

 

Janel Dyan (23:10.71)

I don’t like rules. I think rules are meant to be broken. And I think we, the middle age women today, are bad asses. We have broken rules in so many ways. Right? And we continue to push and break rules and to break the mold and to break the ceiling. You know, you can use any way to say it. So if anything, there’s a one guideline. Confidence. Dress for your confidence.

 

Know your story. And if you don’t know who you are right now, if you’re launching the birds, if you’re stepping away and retiring, great, go experiment. If you think that you want to wear a mini skirt, freaking wear it. And I’ll high five you on the side that is being like, never doing it myself, but I love what you’re doing, right? And think about it, if it’s not just for yourself, we’re giving each other permission too. So when I start to dress for myself, I’m giving you permission to dress for yourself and you’re giving someone else permission to dress for themselves because we’re showing each other that we’re just gonna do this. We’re just, I’m gonna wear my long hair. It’s thin, but I like my ponytail, right? Like, f it. I’m gonna wear a hat. I’m gonna wear a Tucker hat this day because I’m not gonna shower because I’m tired. I just had a hot flash. Whatever it might be, but let’s just be real and enjoy it.

 

Leyla Seka (24:27.781)

Totally, I love that. Yeah, I love that. I mean, all my life people have been telling me how to dress from like my mother putting me in very uncomfortable little dresses that I didn’t want to wear. And then professionally, I’ve told the story many times that like the best advice I ever got professionally was to dress better. And then I started getting promoted and you know, like I had no idea what was going to work and it totally did.

 

Janel Dyan (24:51.214)

Yeah, I mean, I was told, you know, don’t wear a dress, wear a pantsuit and you’ll get a promotion. So, you know, I changed it up and I got fake glasses. I looked a lot smarter, but I, you know, I still have them. My kids wear them for Halloween, but break the rules. whatever, you know, I did feel more confident. That was really hard to go down the escalator because you couldn’t figure that out. But yeah, was, yeah, break the rules. Break the rules. Just let us all enjoy it. I mean, we’ve done so much in our life at this point. We might as well just keep having fun.

 

Leyla Seka (25:24.709)

Yeah, I love that, I love that. Okay, we do have a couple of questions that I think are important. And I’m asked one, then Ruthie can go. But I do want, so like, definitely will sit on Instagram while my kids are watching another Marvel movie for the nine millionth time and like scroll. And I do push the buy button probably more than I should. And I’d say that like 40% of the time something comes and I’m like, ooh, I like it, I’m gonna wear this. And 60% of the time I’m like, this is a piece of shit. This looks awful, why did I buy this? What was I thinking? Like, how do we think about like buying stuff off Instagram or things like that and not getting duped? Like, is there any kind of jujitsu move?

 

Janel Dyan (26:07.214)

Yeah, absolutely. Look, I definitely have hit buy several times and then had the same experience of like, yeah, this ain’t hanging right on me. Or like it shows up in like a ball like that big and you’re like, okay, how the hell is that a size 10? Like, honestly, what am I gonna do with this thing? So a lot of it is when I see something on Instagram, I’m forcing myself not to buy it from Instagram. So I’ll go there, I’ll see, let’s say, you know, cleric shoes, which is my new thing for travel. I love them, they’re mules. And so I will go there, then go to the website. Once I go to the website, then I start looking at reviews, right? I start seeing, okay, and I don’t do the five-star reviews. I go to the ones and twos. And I want to see if there’s like a consistent theme of, does it fit right? Color hue is wrong, whatever it may be. Start to understand and research that one. I also then will go back to Instagram and see if I get any comments within those posts.

 

So then they’ll say, my God, I love this so much and whatever it is. The other thing I really like to do is once you go onto the website, if you can find models and how they’re wearing it, what they’re wearing, a lot of times now they’ll say model is wearing a size small, 5’10”, 125, right? And so you’re like, okay, well, clearly not happening. And so you start to look at measurements and you’re like, you know, I just don’t think I’m gonna be a winner here. It’s just not gonna happen. Or I’ll do more research. I’ll take that brand, go into the search, don’t go to the website, but I’ll just search images. And you’ll start to see other people that are wearing it in real life. And you’ll, you’ll say, okay, is that my body type? How does that look doing those kinds of things? I think return policy is really important. I’ve been screwed where I get it. And then it’s like, you know, team or wherever. And you’re like, okay, return that. And then it’s like, you know, shoved in the corner because you don’t want to show anyone that you did that. And then you put it in your bag to like donate, but then you’re like, God, whatever. So that’s going to be really important. And then if it’s too good to be true, it probably is.

 

Ruthie Miller (28:13.216)

Can we take a second to give thanks for all those people who go online and write honest reviews and post pictures? Because it’s so helpful. I never do it, but I’m so thankful for all the women out there who post honest reviews and photos of themselves in this gear.

 

Leyla Seka (28:28.901)

Totally.

 

Janel Dyan (28:28.94)

Absolutely, I don’t do it and I definitely have huge props for those women that do that and it’s very helpful.

 

Leyla Seka (28:35.255)

It is super helpful. Okay, a couple more things. I’m asking all the questions, but whatever, Ruthie will jump in here in a second. You and I have talked a number of times and you talk about the sit test.

 

Janel Dyan (28:46.894)

I knew you were gonna bring this one up. It’s a really good one as we get older, I swear!

 

Leyla Seka (28:52.415)

So will you explain this and why this is important and how you think about this and how this helps?

 

Janel Dyan (28:58.456)

So originally it started when those low rise jeans happened. And it was when I was young mom and I had gained about 80 pounds with my first child. And I was feeling good. And you’re just loving that you finally get your shit together. We don’t, but we’re trying. And I sat down and I just remember my mom going from behind being like, I can see your underwear, right? Crack kills kind of concept. And I’m like, what? And she is the one that said, you always need to do the sit test, you know, when you’re getting things. And so that is where it was born. The sit test is trying to understand how is your clothes and the style and what you’re wearing, how is it going to live on you when you’re wearing it through the day? So there are some standing only outfits that we have worn when we’re on stage or we go to a gala or whatever and we’re like, this is fine, this is great. But most of the time we’re gonna be wearing clothing that we have to sit down in. And so there’s a couple of things. When you sit down, let’s say for jeans, does your muffin top go over a little bit? Do you feel like where the jean hits on your stomach, does it kind of cut into it and make you feel uncomfortable? No one wants to sit down and feel like things don’t fit them, right? Their brain’s gonna go into, know, they’re not gonna be focused. like, it feels so uncomfortable. So, and again, making sure your underwear doesn’t show, right? Wearing a white tank top that you tuck it in from behind before you sit down so that you don’t have to worry about what’s behind. High-waisted skirts, right? Or a really nice dress when you sit down, does it kind of bulge, right? From the sides, does you start to see the rolls?

 

Does it keep your posture up when you sit or does it naturally slump you down or opposite, right? If you get something more structured and you know that you need to set up a little bit more, does that help you? So just making sure, you live in that? Another one that I’ve told my friends who wear dresses is when you sit down, how high does it go on your legs, right? Where does it go on your thighs? Making sure that for me, I am embracing my cellulite, but like, you know, is that something you’re comfortable showing?

 

It’s not that whether or not the rule is you can’t show it. It’s does that, are you confident and comfortable with that? Another one is when you stand up, think about fabrics like linen, right? They crease and there’s lines. And so again, when you stand up, if you’re gonna take photos after you sit down, like how is that gonna look? know, is it gonna, the longevity of it through the day when you’re wearing it.

 

Leyla Seka (31:38.735)

So helpful.

 

Ruthie Miller (31:39.07)

So for me and Leyla may be in the same situation too, I used to work full time. And now I’m not working full time, but I still occasionally have to go to things like board meetings or financial meetings or various business meetings here and there. Do you recommend any brands or styles, cuts for ways I can be comfortable throughout the day and still look kind of business casual. You mentioned Frank & Eileen, which is a brand I love, but maybe something like that and a little bit more elevated because I, you know, I want to look good, but I never want to sacrifice comfort. 

 

Janel Dyan (32:18.902)

Yeah, no, I agree. think so you have, you know, the J.Crew, right? You have the Everlane, you have the M.M. LaFleur, you have, you know, if you’re on a budget, Zara is a great one that I’ve been finding. You have at Nordstrom’s Veronica Beard, Theory. I mean, those are all kind of the mid price point, because again, I like to think of investment pieces as cost per wear.

 

So like you’re saying, you’re not going into the office five days a week anymore. So when you’re wearing that, the Tom Ford blazer, right? That’s pretty expensive, but you’re wearing it five times or you’re wearing it how many times per quarter? That makes sense. But as you’re only going in once or twice, do you want to invest in something that’s a timeless piece, but only wear it so often, then you’re feeling, I’m not sure. Again, this is all personal preference.

 

Or do you want to say, Hey, look, I want to have some more fun. I’m going to feel like every time I go in there, there’s something new, but I like the structure of a Tom Ford. Zara might be able to find that. I think when it comes to, to, to business casual dressing, especially as you’re kind of keeping that one toe in, but you’re not all the way in the pool, is to go back to your closet and say, what is the cut and the styles and the fabrics that work for me and then go out to those stores and say, okay, not going into anthropology because, you know, ruffles are not me. It’s not going to happen. But I do like the Everlane because it’s clean cut, right? I do like the Max Mara because I really like the camels and the navies, whatever that may be.

 

Ruthie Miller (33:53.664)

Yeah.

 

Leyla Seka (34:04.559)

No, that makes total sense. So one last question and then we have to wrap it up because we’re running out of time. All right, so like accessories as we age. Like I don’t wanna wear pearls, right? That’s not really like old ladies wear pearls. And I’m just like, I have a lot of pearls but I don’t really wanna wear them. It’s just not really my style. 

 

Ruthie Miller (34:25.568)

Really? I don’t see you wearing pearls at all.

 

Leyla Seka (34:29.381)

Pearls were like a thing. Pearls were, you know, like I got some pearls from a high school, like for graduation or something like, yeah. Yeah, it’s not my jam. My mother thought that was like the pinnacle, right? Like I sort of want to look like Iris Apel, you know. That’s sort of like my, like, I want an old lady like her. Yeah..

 

Janel Dyan (34:35.694)

Yes, thanks. She’s a trailblazer for us. Absolutely, absolutely.

 

Leyla Seka (34:55.311)

But how do we think about accessories? Do we buy what we like and wear it and be damned?

 

Janel Dyan (34:59.234)

Yes. Yes. And you know what? Again, experiment. Buy it, love it. Then I’m like, eh, not for me anymore. Share it, right? Or resell it if these are some timeless pieces, right? I mean, our accessories are changing for also function. Two of the three of us are wearing glasses, right? So why don’t we have, I mean, there’s a big boom in some really cool reading glasses that are out there.

 

I mean, that’s a story, that’s a conversation, that’s a permission for other women to be like, embrace the fact you can’t read, you know, without glasses. Wearing that shit, wear green. Again, if you’re wearing navy all the time, Ruthie, right? Why not put on something different, like greens, and you can buy them for $20 here, and you know, all of those things. I’ve always wanted to embrace more accessories. I have such a love of women who go out there,

 

Leyla Seka (35:42.241)

Yeah.

 

Janel Dyan (35:54.07)

And just rock accessories, the scarves, the rings, the earrings, the hats, the, I mean, I see shoes as accessories, right? I see glasses, I see handbags, whatever it is. I mean, have fun. We’re not, fashion, as you said, it doesn’t go to die, right? We’re just going to evolve it, rebirth it, and we’re just gonna do a new whole journey with it. And we’re in this together. So, you know, we’ve gotta just enjoy it and wear the navy. I love black. Black’s my whole power play. It’s, it’s just, I don’t know. I love it. 

 

Leyla Seka (36:33.041)

It cleared the palette all of a sudden. No one was talking about my clothes anymore because I was just wearing black, which suited me just fine. That was amazing. That was so helpful. By the way, you should get Janelle’s book. You should read it. It’s fabulous. It has lots of her tried and true tips. I think my favorite part of this whole thing was just the freedom to do what we want to do.

 

Ruthie Miller (36:42.88)

Absolutely.

 

Ruthie Miller (36:56.256)

Same, same. I’m gonna take my fashion up a notch and I’m gonna say it’s because of Janel. People are gonna be like, wow, you’ve got on a lot of accessories today and you’re wearing orange. Permission. I also, the other thing is I love that you’re encouraging us to go back through our closet and kind of work with what we already have.

 

Janel Dyan (37:06.606)

Could you imagine? Could you imagine? You’ve got the earrings, the scarf, the glasses. You said I could wear whatever I wanted.

 

Leyla Seka (37:10.501)

Is that it?

 

Janel Dyan (37:16.044)

See you later.

 

Ruthie Miller (37:22.57)

I’m a little sad that you didn’t say go out and buy a new wardrobe, Ruthie. But maybe I will anyway, who knows?

 

Janel Dyan (37:27.822)

Well, I mean, I think you’re gonna stick with blue. I really like it. And you know, if you wanna add more color, as I tell my clients, no joke, literally go buy a couch pillow, right? Like still wear your greens and your blues or whatever. And then when you come home, pop it with some color there, get some flowers. But no, this has been absolutely a joy to be here and to talk about it. And we need to keep having more fun, you know, and not judge each other and just.

 

Ruthie Miller (37:30.876)

I think that’s probably right.

 

Janel Dyan (37:57.26)

Trailblaze, we’ve been trailblazers. Let’s keep doing it for the younger generation. Let’s give permission to our parents to have more fun. My mom’s painting her nails now with like different pinks and blues. mean, God forbid she’s spicing it up, but like, let’s do it, right? Let’s all do this together.

 

Leyla Seka (38:13.029)

I love it. I love it.

 

Ruthie Miller (38:13.136)

Amen, sister. And that is a perfect stopping point for us today. Thank you so much for joining us. I really had a blast in this fashion conversation. Everybody, can find a recap, as always, on our website at sideprojecthq.com. And you can learn more about Janelle and her business at storystylebrand.com and probably on all the social channels. Janel, thanks so much for joining us.

 

Janel Dyan (38:37.026)

Thank you. It’s been awesome.